torque converter slip actual vs desired

(author diagram). i called a trans shop and he had no answer,but it sounded strage to him. This is why lifting off the throttle in a car with a fluid coupling or torque converter can feel almost like shifting into neutral. These cookies expire in about 15 days if the user clicks "Remember Me" when logging in; if not, the cookies normally expire when the user closes their browser (or other user agent), or, failing that, within about two days. It will also integrate that knowledge with what type of car and transmission consumers are buying. It stayed there(18.24) from 60mph to 90 when I let off of it. 2. I changed to the Spartan V2 a few weeks ago. There are many different types oftorque converter problems. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. 4. Fluid clutches also dont allow much engine braking. By logging into your account, you agree to our. The _gat cookie, which may appear as _gat_gtag_UA_6113964_2, was sometimes set along with the _ga and _gid cookies to control how frequently requests were sent to the Google Analytics servers; this cookie typically persisted for only a few minutes at a time. I feel better and it makes more sense now. But Ive never heard of anyone going that route. Many of the other listed cookies are associated with the Google Analytics service, the Google AdSense advertising service, and/or other Google advertising and measurement products, which are subject to the Google Privacy Policy; see their "How Google uses information from sites or apps that use our services" page, the "Information for Visitors of Sites and Apps Using Google Analytics" section of the Google Analytics "Safeguarding your data" help page, the "Technologies" section of their Google Privacy & Terms site, and the "Our advertising and measurement cookies" section of the Google Business Data Responsibility site (which includes a detailed list of cookies associated with Google advertising and measurement products) for more information. There are several ways to arrange such a clutch, but the common object is to create a mechanical connection between the engine and the transmission input shaft (which otherwise is driven by the fluid clutchs turbine(s)). For example, in park, it will say Desired Slip 1200, Actual: 730 (guess the engine rpm) As speed increases, the Desired Slip drops (don't remember exact numbers) as well as the actual. works great no real problems. ), These first-party cookies are used to manage user logins and certain other administrative functions of the WordPress content management system, e.g., post editing. There are several actions that could trigger this block including submitting a certain word or phrase, a SQL command or malformed data. I never saw a problem with the converter, it never went over 3 to 4 RPM slippage at WOT with it locked. Your Transmission Gear Ratio at Finish Line. This created the demand for a lockup converter employing an internal clutch inside the converter to directly connect the turbine with the input shaft of the transmission just like a manual-transmission clutch. If the payment button is visible, it may set the third-party cookies PYPF (via paypalobjects.com, which is owned by PayPal, Inc.), which appears to check whether or not you are a logged-in PayPal user, possibly to facilitate the PayPal user login process, and/or 01A1 (via abmr.net, which is owned by Akamai Technologies), which stores certain technical information about your device and browser (or other user agent), possibly to facilitate the login and shopping cart functions. When you have contaminated transmission fluid that has bits of this and that in it This is an indication that you have bigger problems inside the converter or transmission. With the torque slip PID on the DashDAQ. Performance & security by Cloudflare. Its free and only takes a minute, Powered by phpBB Forum Software phpBB Limited. To serve up a little enlightenment, let's take a spin through the torque-converter world and make some sense out of all the superstition. Ate Up With Motor, its logo, and other associated icons and graphics are trademarks and/or service marks of Aaron Severson dba Ate Up With Motor. Sure, there's all kind of talk about stall speed, slippage, and lockup features, but some gearheads secretly believe there's as much voodoo to a torque converter as there is science. Since the 1940s, automakers have come up with a variety of strategies for reducing or eliminating that slip, including series parallel split torque transmissions and different types of converter lockup clutches. For more information, please see our As youll see if you look at the first one, the original iteration had three speeds forward and one reverse, for which it requires four epicyclic gearsets. Those gear ratios were in addition to the torque multiplication provided by the torque converter. Submitting a comment signifies your acceptance of our Comment Policy please read it first! Come join the discussion about diesel performance, modifications, EGR deletes, troubleshooting, lift kits, tires, wheels, maintenance, and more! The one for torque slip desired is 1020 rpm. The good news is, if it is just your torque converter that is having issues since it's a self-contained unit, you may not need to replace or rebuild your whole transmission. Cookie Policy - of course it could be logging falsely No, that just means its not locking, or the pid isn't reading right. 3. and 5. If governor pressure dropped below that threshold, the clutch would disengage. For additional technical information about the cookies used by the analytics service, see their "Google Analytics Cookie Usage on Websites" page; for your reference when reviewing that page, we did not use Google Analytics 4. If you change certain aspects of the site's appearance using the accessibility sidebar, it may set these cookies to manage and remember your settings. Most street torque converters tend to operate in the 3 to 5 percent slippage range, but this can go as high as 8 percent. For more information about Google advertising, see the "Advertising" section of their Google Privacy & Terms site. That's because torque converters transfer the power your car engine makes to the transmission in your car. (PayPal.com, PayPal, and all logos related to the PayPal services are either trademarks or registered trademarks of PayPal, Inc. or its licensors. Thanks for copying the information from my other post here. Google, AdSense, Google AdSense, Google Analytics, and other related marks and logos are trademarks of Google LLC. Off.).) This and the GM automatic history are probably the most definitive descriptions of these technologies on the Internet, excepting pure design and engineering treatises. The result will be every car will have efficient, smooth, and comfortable rides. In this diagram, the yellow arrows show the power flow in second gear. These torque converters allow some slippage but it should not vary much from the desired PCM value. Stator The stator is called the middleman. Generally, by the time you reach the 60-foot mark on the dragstrip, torque multiplication is effectively eliminated and the turbine and impeller speeds are close to achieving what converter manufacturers call coupling speed. The transmission fluid is an important part of the torque converter in that it is used to provide the fluid coupling and smooth starts and without stalling the engine when the vehicle is stopped in gear. Once the vehicle is moving at a constant speed, the speed difference between the impeller and turbine diminishes, eventually reaching a minimum point known as coupling stage. by Silver Flex SEL. Once your torque converter starts failing, you need to be knowledgeable about what torque converter problems will disable your car? by Silver Flex SEL. Required fields are marked *. New to the site and found it because of this read. Over 10 RPM is real slip. However, that did not cure the shuddering problem. With Torque Pro torque slip shows it at 0-6 rpm at 60 mph and when coming to a stop it jumps to 25-40 rpm then raises to 1400+. (At this point, an updated, expanded edition wouldnt go amiss, given all the subsequent development in CVTs and automatics with five or more speeds.). Heat is the enemy of any automatic transmission and will radically reduce its life span if not mediated by an efficient trans cooler. T43 Torque Converter Desired Slip. In drive at 0 speed TCD should read 1020 rpm and TCA should be Engine RPM - Its weird its not noticable as even a new soft engaging lock up but it acts somewhat like it has one. Anyway, I downloaded FORscan on my laptop and loaded several pids for the transmission. The TCC solenoid regulates the fluid pressure to the clutch. Most street cars cannot keep the rear tires from spinning if you add too much throttle, and this tends to limit the stall speed. Each PayPal payment or donation button may also incorporate a tracking pixel called "pixel.gif" (which loads from paypalobjects.com). Your Transmission Fluid is Contaminated. This slippage is part of what determines the stall speed of the converter. With a manual transmission, you are allowed the freedom to pick the starting-line rpm you want to apply when you dump the clutch. This has been a quick jaunt through world of torque converters, but it should at least inspire some intelligent questions to ask your converter company of choice as to the best converter for your application. These early units operated on the same principal of using one electric fan to drive another. When you coast in gear, the transmission attempts to drive the engine crankshaft, whose inertia causes a braking effect. Packard achieved that goal by treating the engagement of the lockup clutch like an automatic gear change. If you use the buttons to make a payment or donation, the PayPal services will set additional cookies (not listed here) to manage your PayPal login and transaction data (and potentially also for various other purposes, e.g., user analytics and/or advertising). In the early Studebaker Automatic Drive (Borg-Warner DG) transmission, the flywheel drives the torque converter impeller, front pump, and lockup clutch pressure plate (red). Well Aaron . Logging in sets the wordpress_logged_in_xx, wordpress_sec_xx, and/or wordpress_xx cookies, which store the user's login credentials to allow access to the administrative dashboard and other administrative functions; there may be multiple iterations of each cookie. Im not able to provide repair or maintenance advice, sorry! This is how the first fluid couplings were designed, but they were hideously inefficient because of high slippage. It will read really high numbers until the converter is locked. check out the. When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Your torque converter is full of fluid, and its jobis to act as a hydraulic pump and acts as a coupling between the engine and the transmission. At stall speed, the impeller is spinning at engine rpm and the turbine is stopped. It is not common for the knock sensors to fail, especially at such a low mileage. With the clutch engaged, Ultramatic also transmitted some drivetrain vibration that the torque converter would otherwise have absorbed. Google, Google Analytics, and other related marks and logos are trademarks of Google LLC.). Think of a lock TC as the clutches in your tranny. iThemes is one of the Liquid Web family of brands; iThemes and Liquid Web are trademarks of Liquid Web, LLC.). If your car transmission keeps overheating, you may also notice your transmission starts to act funny, or it may even go into fail date and stay in one gear and not shift at all. (author diagram). A forum community dedicated to Ford Power Stroke owners and enthusiasts. So when the torque converter clutch engages there should be almost 0rpm difference between tc slip desired and tc slip act. For more information about what data PayPal services collect and how that data may be used, visit the "Legal Agreements for PayPal Services" page to review the PayPal Privacy Statement and Statement on Cookies and Tracking Technologies that apply in your location (the Statement on Cookies and Tracking Technologies that applies to each region is linked from within the applicable PayPal Privacy Statement). Although torque converters are ideal launch devices for. I had just bought an SCT with Gearhead tunes. The torque converter of the future will have a carefully tuned control strategy, which takes into account the torque demands of each vehicle. if you dont hammer on it everyday it will last you a long time.. my stock converter had 350 rpms of slip on (For more information about our discontinuation of Google Analytics tracking on this website, see the "Online Tracking" section of the Privacy Policy. Torque Converter Engaged while pulling??? They normally expire after about one year. A 5 percent slippage factor means that if the impeller is spinning 3,000 rpm, the turbine is only spinning 2,850, or 5 percent slower. On early Ultramatic-equipped Packards, the lockup clutch would not engage until road speed reached at least 15 mph (24 km/h) even on a light throttle. When you submit a comment, you may have the option save your information for future comments, storing the info in these cookies. Primary symptom includes a "rumble strip" like sound randomly while driving at speeds of about 40+. Not all the listed cookies and/or data items are necessarily set in all instances, and there may sometimes be others not listed above, particularly if you are logged into a Google account. Ate Up With Motor and its embedded content providers may use cookies and/or similar technologies and collect personal information about site visitors as described in the Privacy Policy and Cookie Notice. by SirHandyMan Fri Mar 29, 2019 3:24 pm, Post Third, make sure that your engine is running right because a transmission chuggle can be caused by many things. You only monitor it when the converter is locked. The one-way stator clutch (fuchsia) allows the stator (light blue) to freewheel in the direction of engine rotation, but reverse rotation locks the stator against the fixed stator shaft (dark gray), providing torque multiplication under some conditions. I took it to my mechanic and he too found nothing wrong. In the Packard Ultramatic transmission, the input shaft drives the hub of the direct drive clutch and the input sun gear of the Ravigneaux gearset (all colored medium blue). scheme, but it does contribute. Your car's automatic transmission has a torque converter. Members can start their own topics & subscribe to topics abs thank you for posting your experience here. Some persist for only a few minutes, or until you close your browser (or other user agent); others may remain in your browser (or other user agent) as long as your individual settings permit. I cant imagine the hours of work which you must have put into understanding these various transmissions, to say nothing of writing up a description that a simpleton like me could (mostly) understand. The problems come in many sizes, shapes, and forms. For one, the engine would stall every time the vehicle came to a halt with the lockup clutch engaged unless the driver shifted to neutral each time. Failing Torque Converter Clutch with Slippage - Could be your TCC Solenoid, Re: Failing Torque Converter Clutch with Slippage - Could be your TCC Solenoid, https://www.ecoboostperformanceforum.co 733.0.html. Dr. Tranny helped for a short time and then the car became entirely undriveable. Even though Dyno numbers are just a number, For reference my 2018 Gen3 made 400rwhp/390rwtq stock with 5k miles on a Dynojet,, It hit the speed limiter at 6700. 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(Those pages do not currently discuss the storage of data in your browser (or other user agent) using technologies other than cookies, e.g., in web storage.) Since taking all the of the steps outlined above, I can confirm that the transmission has been running properly and the clutch working as expected. Your ring and pinion (gear size) Your circumference or roll out of the rear tires. Shifting to third gear was accomplished by engaging the torque converter lockup clutch. Privacy Statement - This overran the rear unit planet carrier, unlocking the rear sun gears one-way clutch and putting the transmission in direct drive. The car has just under 77k miles. 91.234.33.200 (If you need to review or change these settings after you accept, you can do so from the Privacy Tools page.) Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -. The multiplication factor is based on the speed difference between the turbine and impeller. Second, the nonlinear relationship between impeller and turbine speed can be troublesome. I agree that a manual transmission option would be great. Cloudflare Ray ID: 7c0ed4b2fd769016 My SunCoast converter has a little slip. A third drum (dark green) allows the overrunning clutchs outer race to be locked in place by the forward band, which is engaged in all forward gears. A manufacturer's torque-converter rating is generally expressed as an rpm range. One of the fundamental differences between a fluid clutch (a fluid coupling or torque converter) and a mechanical plate clutch is slippage. So I picked up a scan tool to save on the abundant diagnosing fees associated with owning a 2005 5.4 f150. I wouldn't worry about it, but I'm not familiar with your specific transmission. Archive - If you correctly enter the password, the site saves this cookie on your device to allow you access to the password-protected post or page. This creates the greatest speed difference between the turbine and the impeller and therefore the maximum torque multiplication. The knock sensor wire harness connector was loose. This viscous connection is transmission fluid. A healthy plate clutch slips only briefly when engaged or disengaged. Remember, a torque converter is a coupler between the engine and transmission. Unless you have tune that keeps the converter unlocked, the converter should've locked. Tire slip is likely causing your speed difference. Multiple different problems, some transmission related, some engine related, all resulting in driveability issues. Accessing the login page sets the wordpress_test_cookie, a session cookie that tests whether the user's browser (or other user agent) will allow the cookies needed to log in to the administrative dashboard; this cookie normally expires when the user closes their browser (or other user agent). 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